Original Saga,  Prequel Trilogy,  Skywalker Saga

New Star Wars Celebration Chicago poster art revealed

From Cristiano Siqueira:

“Very proud to finally be able to share this work with you!
I spent a good part of the last year second semester working on these Star Wars characters for Lucas Film. This work will be the key art of the “Star Wars Celebration 2019”, a big Star Wars fan event that happens in Chicago, at April this year.”

swcc_poster.jpg

0 Comments

  • Bob Jones

    We surely can’t complain about this one right? I know Anakin is missing but Disney has been weird about portraying Anakin and Vader together in any capacity. That’s my guess as to why he’s not here.

    Just remember, he’s coming to battlefront in a huge update. A game which will likely have more players than people attending SW Celebration. So Anakin exposure is still out there?

    • Stefan

      Personally, I agree.
      We should not forget that such posters are (also) aimed at the “average” audience (and I do not use “average” in a negative sense here) – they are part of an advertising campaign.
      And one thing easy to understand? Good v evil, hence the strict separation in this poster – and no place for Anakin because he would break this premise.

      Could Disney do it differently? Technically yes, but in practice… I would not be surprised if the poster would look different if GL was still in charge because Anakin’s fall and redemption are central to SW. Disney however prefers to “play it safe.”

  • lovelucas

    Of course we can complain about this one: No Anakin No Star Wars saga. How much clearer can we make it? It’s HIS freakin’ story. And that’s according to the MAKER. And shall we assume his elimination – TWICE – equate to no Hayden at Celebration???? Putting it out there….that’s the only reason I bought a 5-day pass and the person who I was going to sell it to decided not to attend so………

  • Cryogenic

    @ Bob Jones:

    “We surely can’t complain about this one right?”

    Star Wars fans can complain about anything. 😉 :p

    And, in this case, I would say the complaints are valid.

    Anakin is absent again. Yabba dabba doo!

    And just as acutely: While Padme, as Amidala, at least gets decent placement in this version, along with Obi-Wan, just underneath, the poster remains a very OT-and-ST-centric affair.

    On the right side, the villain side, it’s even worse. Yes, no less than three prequel villains are present, but they are among the smallest figures, with Luke and Vader clearly dominating on their respective sides.

    No clones. No Threepio. No Jar Jar. No Qui-Gon. No Shmi. No Watto. No Jango. No Nute. No Bail. No Mace. No Dex. And again: No Anakin.

    It is pretty clear this poster exudes little love of the prequels. And yet, in some ways, it is “better” than the other versions unveiled a few days ago. Which is depressing. Because this appears to be “as good as it gets”.

    But yeah, they really love the prequels at Lucasfilm, don’t they? Can’t you feel the love? The gratitude? The pride? The passion? The recognition? The respect?

    • Bob Jones

      I get what you’re saying, but… this is a poster. Like, just a poster. SW Celebration will reach a much smaller audience than all of the prequel related merch and other things coming out.

      I agree the prequels 10000% don’t get the respect they deserve, but with everything Lucasfilm HAS been doing, I can’t believe they, as an organization, hate the prequels. If anything, the prequels weren’t “marketable” for a while, but they definitely are now, and even are on the rise. I think all of this is a positive step, but I do agree we aren’t there yet.

      Maybe I’m desperate, but I’m satisfied with the direction is going.

      • Cryogenic

        @ Bob:

        Well, first of all, it’s called “Star Wars Celebration”. It is directly billed as “The Ultimate Fan Experience”, and it is essentially the Star Wars equivalent of Christmas or Thanksgiving; peace on Earth, good will to all men, and all that uplifting stuff. Yet this poster communicates little of that ecumenical cheer. The prequel trilogy, compared to the original and sequel trilogies, is very clearly snubbed and frozen out.

        Furthermore, these Celebration events only got started because of the prequels, with the first Celebration event held in 1999, and a further seven events taking place before Disney got its mitts on the franchise. So a little more respect for the history of the event itself wouldn’t, in my opinion, go astray.

        “Hate” is a misnomer and a red herring. I never said Lucasfilm hates the prequels. I implied the company is showing little love for them. It is like they have been abandoned as a bastard creation. There’s something cold and calculating in Lucasfilm’s posture toward them; something beyond hatred.

        If the prequels weren’t marketable, it’s only because they chose to adopt that stance and pull all prequel-based projects and withdraw support — like “The Clone Wars”, the 3D re-releases, snubbing Lucas’ sequel treatments (a trilogy intended to expand on important story elements like the midi-chlorians, which many people disliked, in the PT), and blatantly making digs at characters like Jar Jar (which both J.J. Abrams and Kathleen Kennedy equally engaged in in the PR campaign for “The Force Awakens”), while shunning others all the way up to the mains (especially Padme).

        On top of all that, the sequel trilogy was pimped to fans as a return to the “proper way of doing things”, with an aggressive and ridiculous emphasis on “practical effects” and “tangible sets”, and an endless stream of virtue signalling concerning “relateable characters” and “good storytelling”, buttressed with a peculiar and desperate-sounding set of reassuring burbles on how much “enthusiasm” and “love” was being spilled into the project, with a heavy dollop of social justice posturing for good measure. And, of course, the name “George Lucas” was barely mentioned at all, as if merely invoking it was tantamount to uttering a racial slur.

        Apart from that, yeah… It’s just a poster. No need for anyone to overreact. Situation normal. Move along, move along.

        • lovelucas

          Gnashing of the teeth. One of the reasons I did not attend the last Celebration was due to the disrespect shown to George and the prequels at the previous Celebration. As mentioned above, George Lucas’ name was not mentioned – it was avoided. Until Ian McD made this a big deal at his packed session. Finally someone acknowledging why they were all here. JJ…grrrrrrrr and now KK ..who for f sake should have been the first to applaud and remind and remember. George…trusted her. That poster sucks in so many ways. I prefer R2 over the rolling, cloying, needy cheeto droid, I prefer him certainly over C3POoo. George said only R2 knows the entire story. So WHY wasn’t ot important enough to acknowledge him? Speaking of….Kenny Baker, who has just died, wasn’t mentioned at that Celebration either. And we need Padmé more than Queen Amidala. Jeez – don’t these people even know the story?

        • lovelucas

          Need and editing tool…. Kenny Baker had just died before that Celebration. and so why wasn’t IT important enough yada yada yada

      • Slicer87

        I really hated the toxic marketing for TFA, which was nothing more than a poor and lazy ANH remake. That is besides dragging the OT characters through the mud and taking a dump on their struggles and final accomplushments, rendering the whole segs void just to lazily reset everything back to the statis quo of rebels vs empire all over again. So that nothing was accomplished from the Lucas sega. God, the ST pisses me off.

      • Cryogenic

        @ Love Lucas:

        I don’t mind them featuring Amidala instead of Padme. It’s good to see Episode I get some representation; and the whole “Belle Epoch”/Jidaigekai aesthetic of the prequels/Old Republic is indirectly acknowledged through that guise of Padme’s. But this poster is not problem-free. And yet it’s still the better of the posters they’ve just rolled out. Look at that other one under discussion the other day. Farcical!

        I’ll add that Lawrence Kasdan gave what seemed like an “off-script” shout-out to the “Monster Genius” of Lucas at the Comic-Can panel in July 2015. It’s also notable, that very same moment, for Kathleen Kennedy’s reaction. She looks really tight-faced as Kasdan reminds the audience that Lucas is the reason they’re all there; and while Kasdan, the hired hand, rambles away, speaking like a human being instead of a mindless shill, she can be seen tapping and rubbing the table with thinly-concealed annoyance/irritation.

        And a word on the droids:

        Artoo and Threepio are the stars of Star Wars. I think that much is plainly evident after the prequels. You go back and watch the original trilogy and it all but hits you in the face. They are one of the masterstrokes of the saga. Lucas was insistent on portraying the original through their eyes. He tried opening the film with Luke, but he quickly reverted back to his earlier, more abstract desire that the droids lead us into the story — and what a choice that was.

        To see those same characters pushed to the very edge of the story (me editing myself: what story???!) in the sequel trilogy really grates. And it signals something quite devastating: The sequels are disconnected from history, from myth, from legend. They basically represent a break from the mythic continuity of the Lucas films. In the new continuity, there are now, in effect, no living witnesses to history. Even Anakin’s lightsaber has more personality and agency than the droids.

        Many threads were lost and destroyed when Disney chose to bin Lucas’ sequel treatments. More than we’ll ever likely know.

        And KK really stabbed Lucas in the back. She went from averring that Lucas was her “Yoda” in 2012 to boasting of her own prowess at running Lucasfilm in 2015, passing judgement on his character/design choices in the process, when it seemed all but inevitable TFA was about to reap a handsome profit at the box office. Talk about restrained and humble.

      • Cryogenic

        @ Slicer:

        Right??? The galling lack of creativity, blatant disregard for the existing saga, and general mothballing of the mythology of Star Wars stinks up TFA something rotten. How DARE they! That phrase is often used ironically these days, but I mean to bring back its original bite. Sequel trilogy was trashed out of the starting gate. As soon as Disney said to Lucas behind closed doors: “Thanks, but no thanks.” And then the next “seismic charge” detonation event: Bringing in J.J. Abrams, the prince of pandering. The fate of the sequel trilogy was set in that moment.

    • Slicer87

      Forgot to add that similar to the already aluded reason why Anakin is not included in the poster. The “clonetroopers” were likely not included because similar to Anakin, they are seemingly heros who turn bad, though the films hint at they were never good guys to begin with.

    • Cryogenic

      @ Slicer:

      Applying the same logic, there’s no need to feature Padme, either. She’s the mother of the twins, and Luke and Leia are there, so that’s sufficient. Similarly, we can infer Threepio because Artoo is there, and Mace was close to Yoda and Obi-Wan, and they’re on the poster. Also, people whined that the prequels are full of bright and shiny things designed to shift merchandise, so Phasma perfectly represents a boatload of prequel characters and designs.

      • Slicer87

        I wasn’t trying to defend the poster, just trying to find some silver lining in it. What would have been nice would be seeing the progression of troopers from Republic to Empire.

        As for Plasma and the other nutroopers, they are posers, not real stormtroopers. Much like the ST are poser films, not real SW films.

      • Cryogenic

        @ Slicer:

        A progression would have been nice, yes.

        I can’t see the “nutroopers” as real stormtroopers, either.

        The designs, in my opinion, are terrible next to the originals — and the originals aren’t all that convincing next to the clone troopers, in my opinion.

        So there’s basically a descending hierarchy, as far as I am concerned, from prequel, to original, to sequel.

        A real shame. They had better designs in “The Art Of The Force Awakens” book. But, of course, they degraded everything to ultimately look as “retro” as possible; while repainting the old designs just enough for rabid fans to bend over backwards justifying the new cherry on top of the moldy, slanting cake.

        Indeed, I want to remind people of this remark from Abrams in 2015, where he tried to justify the rehashed designs (and indirectly maligned the prequels) “bcz strwrs”:

        Abrams: If they were still making X-Wings, If they were still making TIE Fighters, If they were still making Stormtroopers, what would they do? how would they evolve? There were endless conversations about these things. There have been hundreds if not thousands of movies where the design has been influenced by Star Wars and yet could not be Star Wars. They couldn’t do something as badass as a TIE Fighter, couldn’t do something as undeniable as a Stormtrooper, because you couldn’t rip off Star Wars. But when you are doing something that takes place within that world, to not incorporate those things felt borderline criminal.

        https://www.empireonline.com/movies/features/force-awakens-full-story/

      • Slicer87

        Its not like ROTJ showed technological advancement and new ship designs. Even in the late OT,TIEs were giving way to TIE interceptors and X and Y Wings were being joined by newer and sleeker A and B Wings. Its sad ROTJ is less like the OT than TFA is. Plus the shoehorned in Death Star 3, Kylo wearing a helmet for no reason, new darksiders pulled from JJ’s butt, rump state Empire that is inexplicable more powerful than the old Empire, etc.

        I think the way ROTJ wrapped things up so nicely makes any kind of sequal story difficult. Even Lucas at one time said that nothing happens after ROTJ. That Leia becomes a senator, Han retires and flips burgers in their backyard, it would be a pretty boring film according to him. Sad thing is that would have been a better film than TFA was.

      • Cryogenic

        @ Slicer:

        Exactly. Things definitely advanced in ROTJ — or had advanced by that time. Inside the universe and outside of it. Hell, there was a much more sophisticated hologram (if not necessarily a “better” one) showing Endor and the Death Star in the rebel conference room, compared to the fragile wire-frame rendering shown in ANH (but still a cool early use of computer graphics).

        I think that change alone gives some sense of where a Lucas-headed ST might have gone and what it might have looked like. That and the prequels, of course. Lucas had all the tech, even just the displays, looking pretty slick; even if they were still a bit crude, they had a subtle presence and personality all their own. I don’t detect any of this in the Disney films. I mean, I liked the holograms in TLJ, but all the tech feels wrong. Primitive. Limited. Constrained. Dull. Dour. Depressing.

        By the timeframe of ROTJ, as you just indicated, the ship designs had evolved and had become more variegated. TESB also brought things forward a notch. For instance, it was the first glimpse of those big Mon Calamari rebel cruisers, which had a very unusual cylindrical “matte” look — a look, it was felt, that might not actually work too well on camera, with the limited visual effects processes of the time. But it turned out great. On the other hand, the spindly B-Wings in ROTJ were less successful (didn’t show up too well against the dark background of space), but it’s still nice to know they’re there.

        Another striking feature about the original films (and also the prequels) is the variety of foot soldier. Only the first film concerns itself solely with the classic “stormtrooper”. And even then, the monotony is broken up by having troopers riding dewbacks, wearing strange backpacks and shoulder pads, and carrying heavy-grade weaponry. In the last act of the film, stormtroopers and TIE Fighter pilots are shown racing around the halls of the Death Star; and when the heroes first arrive, pulled in by the tractor beam, there’s that shot of a troupe of stormtroopers running behind a mouse droid. All of this adds a ton of carefully-calibrated visual intrigue. And it doesn’t end with the first film. In TESB, you had snowtroopers; in ROTJ, we got scout troopers and speeder bikes.

        But what does TFA do for variety; or, for that matter, TLJ? Barely anything. There’s Phasma (a waste), that novelty shock trooper that battles Finn (who improbably defends himself with Anakin’s lightsaber), and in TFA, that’s about it. Oh, flame troopers, I suppose. But you never see any of the troopers riding anything, carrying other forms of weaponry, or wearing unique armour. TLJ improved things a tad with Snoke’s royal guard — though, just like the regular First Order stormtroopers, they’re basically a rip-off of the Emperor’s guard, even if they do have cool weaponry. And that’s about it. Except for when those stormtroopers go to execute Finn and Rose with a version of the royal guard’s electrical blades. It’s not nearly what the OT and PT did. Kills the immersion and stops it feeling like an expansive, lived-in world.

        But anyway. I could rant and rant away.

        ROTJ certainly wraps things up in a neat bow. It provides a very solid end. It’s a wonderful close to the saga. But it needn’t have been the complete end. I suspect Lucas would have delivered a more ethereal sequel trilogy. As he recently revealed: He wanted to explore the microbiotic world of the Force. And if you are open-minded and receptive to the more esoteric implications of Star Wars, you can probably admit that midi-chlorians and the “Living Force” were incredibly compelling concepts that Lucas wove into the PT via Episode I. He obviously wanted to get more into them in the sequels; but his heart and mind weren’t aligned. There’s the rub. I think Lucas will take many of his deeper ponderings and intimations about the universe with him to the great beyond. We must survive on the breadcrumbs he left behind. He has brought a “strange magic” into popular culture, indeed…

        • lovelucas

          Forgot to add a primary defender – always – has been Tom Hodges. He was one of the panelists on the begrudgingly (scheduled) session on the prequels at – I think it was Celebration 7 but might have been 6. He defended defended – would not it down, could not be stopped – the prequels. This was one of the only anything that had anything to do with the prequels at Celebrations post prequels. By the way it was standing room only.
          And I have always defended – because I LOVE the concept – of the midichlorians (hyphen or not?) because it was pure George. Laying the pathway to return.

          and I did see what you did there…….with “strange magic”

      • Cryogenic

        @ Love Lucas:

        Thanks for noticing that, LL. 😉

        Great that at least some people are willing to stick up for the prequels in high places. Or is that high-low places? Where does Celebration “place”?

        The Internet has really defined the bulk of the negativity/misunderstanding and also, ironically, the small degree of respect, admiration, and intellectual regard for them. In other words: A double-edged sword.

        Both the prequels and the Internet have one thing strongly in common: The potential within is still barely tapped. They have a weird symbiotic relationship of their own. Speaking of which:

        The official spelling of midi-chlorians suggests they should have a hyphen.

        A weird little detail I noticed in the “explanation” scene on the landing platform in TPM, is that they are mentioned exactly four times, and each time, if you’re using subtitles, they show up differently, as follows:

        “midi-chlorians.”
        “midi-chlorians?”
        “Midi-chlorians”
        “midi-chlorians,”

        See? Their symbolic representation in written language has a morphic quality.

        Lots of fantastic ideas encoded into the midis. A very deep meditation aid!!!

        Lucas is basically one-hundred years ahead of his time. An entity OUT of time.

        “A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away….”

    • Cryogenic

      @ Joey:

      Yep. And it wouldn’t matter, anyway.

      Clonetroopers and stormtroopers clearly represent different eras.

      Moreover, both pre-dating and fighting opposite clones, were… droids.

      And we see no proper droid representation outside of Artoo and Grievous. Though I suppose someone could argue, much like the “OT stormtrooper is a clone” argument, that Grievous represents the droid armies of the CIS.

      But there’s still a general lack of prequel representation. And here’s another thing to think about: The prequels are so visually dense that you’d expect them to feature heavily, as opposed to lightly and barely at all.

    • Slicer87

      Lucas stated that the stormtroopers inheirited their head bumping traits from Jango, which is why he had Jango bump his head in AOTC. So at least some OT stormtroopers are still Jango clones regardless of Disney’s rewrites. Plus as far back as 1978, there were articles stating stormtroopers were cloned men, describing what would be seen in AOTC. Sadly, Disney is hellbent on purging as much PT references from the other films as much as possible.

      I don’t like to view the PT and OT as seperate eras as so much that the OT is the continuation of the events of the PT. The Empire continues to use walkers, twin ion engine fighters (V-wings to TIEs), and star destroyers like the Republic used, makes sense they would contine cloning troops with everything else they keep using.

      • Slicer87

        Furthermore, I agree it would be nice to see a B1, Nute, and Jabba in the darkside of the poster. While the lightside should have Anakin, Mace, JRp
        Jar-Jar, Wicket, and Wedge. At least there are no Progs or BB8.

      • joey pieper

        forgot about that bit which was a clever way to explain a blooper in anh if lucas hadn’t been treated like garbage by the fans and media maybe he wouldn’t have sold the company to disney in the first place

      • Cryogenic

        @ Slicer:

        I’m down with porgs and BB-8. I’m a sucker for the cutesy elements of the saga. But at least show a more balanced set of characters and visual elements. Not the boring drag and exclusionary tethering of OT and ST, with the prequels shoved into a subordinate position.

        It’s kind of irrelevant, to me, whether the stormtroopers are clones or not. I mean, they all sort of look and act the same, so they are de facto “clones”, and that is surely part of the joke and a good example of Lucas’ sardonic humour.

        But clones and stormtroopers also behave differently. Clones are more like soldiers, stormtroopers more like keystone cops. There is a qualitative difference. They broadly symbolise, relatively speaking, the dynamic transformation of one body into another (Republic to Empire) and then the sloth of the bureaucratic/technocratic mechanism that takes the galaxy hostage.

        So, to me, they aren’t the same.

        The OT is a continuation of the PT, but not a complete linear progression. One’s a costume drama/historical tragedy, the other is more of an action-comedy “hero” fable. Ultimately, all the films mesh together as one “twelve-hour movie”, to use Lucas’ coinage, but individual blocks of story time have their own look and feel, too — and that, to me, is the essential beauty of it.

      • Cryogenic

        @ Joey:

        Yes. That was a way to explain a blooper. And, in the words of Dex, a “damn good one”, too.

        And I also ponder the same thing. Would Lucas have sold if the fanbase hadn’t treated him like crap for fifteen years straight?

        It must be hard for anyone, even someone with the fortitude of George Lucas, to endure slander and insult every day of their life, without end, without it affecting their outlook; particularly over the thing that generated all the slander to begin with…

        • lovelucas

          So true. Which is one reason we were both banned (me temporarily, you ??) from TheForce dot whatever. Defending George, defending the prequels. Stating repeatedly that it was HIS freaking story so he would know who is the hero, who is not. And there were worse forums – got into swearing nasty nasty with body parts and also stating that anyone who defended George was a pansy whose opinion on anything wasn’t worth….excrement. So..ya – Can you imagine how George felt?

      • Slicer87

        Some of the difference may be unintentional. The reason Lucas elected to render the troops in the PT entirely by CGI was to avoid the issues he had with directing extras in the OT. During the filming of the OT, the extras playing the stromtroopers were constantly bumping into sets, into each other, tripping, falling, and even badly hurting themselves. In some scenes you can see the extras hold their helmets in place as they run. Partly due to the poor quality and fit of the stromtrooper costumes. With CGI troops, he doesn’t have those problems, they follow their orders perfectly. But then JJ had to go back to real extras and have those problems again. But hey, he can have weird and pointless cameos.

        I still like the little Jango easter egg in AOTC to explain the ANH goof. TCW series even continued the joke in the first season with having a couple clones bumping their heads with the same sound effect used in ANH and AOTC.

        Either way, both clonetroopers and stormtroopers in the films express less emotion and personality than even the battle droids, let alone R2 and C3PO.

      • Cryogenic

        @ Slicer:

        Good points.

        However, even if there were a pragmatic dimension to Lucas rendering clonetroopers with CG, they still feed into the disquieting ambience of the films — vis-a-vis the tangible, sclerotic world of the OT. After all, Episode I is subtitled “The Phantom Menace”, and that’s more or less what the clones are: a not-real, not-there menace. And the clones show up roughly half-way into the prequel trilogy, including baby clones, kicking restlessly in their little jars, right as Anakin’s upsetting dreams intensify and he resolves to rescue his mother — leaving paradise (Naboo) and dragging his “angel” with him. And the clones, of course, have no mother. From an origins perspective, they are like mirrored inversions of one another. Then, in Episode III, you have Sidious boasting that the Dark Side of the Force offers the power to create life and save it from death; before using those very clones to wrest ultimate control of the Republic. Very interesting stuff.

        Great spot on the droids vs. the clones and stormtroopers. Remember that Lama Su tells Obi-Wan that they made the clones “less independent than the original host”; while in the same scene reassuring him that “clones can think creatively” and that the Jedi will find them “immensely superior to droids” (echoing Obi-Wan to Dex when discussing the origin of the dart that leads Obi-Wan to Kamino: “Well, if droids could think, there’d be none of us here, would there?”). But, as it turns out, a prima facie reading of the films suggests that droids possess colourful personalities and are highly adept at solving problems. Yet they aren’t recognised as persons in their own right. Just like the clones. When Padme expresses shock that Anakin is a slave, she doesn’t seem to realise how many beings in Star Wars are slaves of one sort or another. This is subtly brilliant on Lucas’ part.

        Freedom is a difficult concept. I love the tragicomic fate of the battle droids and how they shade all the tragedy and waste and wretched tediousness of being. Star Wars is kind of an existential comedy. A baroque “theatre of the absurd” — courtesy of Akira Kurosawa, Stanley Kubrick, and Alex Raymond.

        • lovelucas

          To Cryo yet again….. Dude. We who love them know every word of the dialogue from the prequels. Having seen them each many, many times in the theater (only 9) for TPM, but for AotC – 39 times, RotS – 51 times – we know that dialogue, we know there’s a reason why George put that in there and sometimes it’s who’s speaking which makes it even more emphatic but you, sir, (exnay – I really hate that word) but you, Cryogenic, have crystallized the intention. Oye – as much as I would love to meet George, I think you deserve it more because it would somehow be…mutual.

      • Cryogenic

        @ Love Lucas:

        Thank you, LL. You do me a tremendous amount of credit.

        But really, if I have insights, it’s because I draw sustenance — my daily Star Wars bread — from the awesome input/output of other fans and the few media commentators and academics that actually get what Lucas is about; or who at least expound, via their own perceptive prisms, on some of the concepts and ideas at play.

        In turn, that enables me to see a bit more into that marvellous marble block, allowing a certain kind of “biomolecular synthesis” to take place, as insights bubble and collide and gradually coalesce, producing new “amino acids” (Kaminoan acids), new thought-forms, which can almost attach onto that block, barnacle-like, or like a thin bio-film, painting it a different shade, giving into a new reflective quality.

        Sounds a bit pretentious, but I’m just trying to colourfully explain a sort of collectivist process, as my personality field interacts with the fields — or the Force — of others. The “Noosphere” of the Internet, this weird, grand mechanism, fosters a formidable exchange of thought patterns. It’s essentially like having a galactic brain on-tap, available at the press of a button. Brilliant. And also slightly disquieting.

        “The Force dot whatever”. 😀 😀 😀

        I was banned permanently. Or let us say: indefinitely. No ban is necessarily forever, but in practical terms, I was cut off from even appealing my ban — a feature meant to be available to all. And another measure of the pro-Disney poison that has infected the boards. Also a measure of social justice intolerance — the cloak that is used to justify all actions (including defending global corporations). Staunch adherents of this movement believe they’re accountable to no-one and automatically in possession of the “higher ground”.

        Obviously, those people are dead to the prequels and the lessons they teach. One mod even said in a thread concerning users being banned, coldly hissing in a single line, that she failed to see where a user being banned was ever a mod’s fault:

        “You know, M’Lady, Count Dooku was once a Jedi. He couldn’t assassinate anyone. It’s not in his character.”

        They literally don’t get anything about the movies; not anything that matters. That’s pretty disturbing. But also a further demonstration that people weren’t really ready for these movies or the cogent riffs, jabs, and warnings conveyed therein.

        And, as you said, there have certainly been worse boards, not much better than sewer drains. It is therefore sad and more than a little disappointing to see one of the better places — indeed, one of the best places there was — finally subverted by the anti-Lucas/pro-Disney bashing forces that real prequel fans did so much to try and counteract, and stop from having supreme authorial control. All, ultimately, to little avail.

        Lucas selling to Disney gave these people the perfect opportunity to seize power and censor debate, especially after Kennedy’s green light that people who wanted Star Wars to be about redressing social injustices were “right”, and anybody who critiqued their approach, and their whole weaponising of Lucas’ creation for profit, were “wrong” — wrong in terms of being racist, sexist, misogynist, hateful, vicious, stupid, ignorant Alt-Right trolls. How convenient. If you have an opinion they don’t share or publicly imply they hold (a crucial distinction there), then you must be villainous by default. “If you’re not with my, you’re my enemy.”

        It was always like pushing a boulder up a mountain trying to argue the virtues of the prequels, but criticising Disney was essentially made illegal on TFN — especially coming from prequel fans who wanted to speak about and resolve what Disney were doing through a wider lens (versus those in love with the OT who saw very little problem with Disney’s approach circa 2012 – 2017; and who wasted little time insulting prequel fans and coarsening any focused discussion that was loosely permitted before censorship intensified).

        You saw the movies so many times!!! And all your love and support since. You should be first in line to meet George. Your own dedication and intelligence are beyond doubt. I’m just a simple-minded Jar Jar lover trying to make my way in the universe. 🙂

      • Slicer87

        You too? I was banned from the TFN forums last spring. Just as well as they were becoming less enjoyable each passing day. I was only a member for three years but man did that place change in that time frame. Not even sure why I was banned, don’t care either. Sadly I think most of the fandom is becoming increasingly toxic and fractured. There are the angry OOT purists who only like the OOT, or just OO ANH and TESB. The Disney fans and SJWs who only like the ST. Then us Lucas sega fanx who are either ignored at best, or treated with complete scorn by the other groups at worst.

      • Cryogenic

        @ Slicer:

        Ay up, Slicer! Of course, of course…

        I was almost posting in a stupor before. But I remember you. Was just going back over some old posts. We crossed paths a bit on there. In a good way. 🙂

        You tell a familiar story. There was a thread on another Star Wars forum I was reading through about a year ago, where a bunch of members were commiserating with one another and explaining run-ins with TFN mods, and telling of random, crooked bans that were applied to their accounts. Several members relayed how some TFN mod had informed them that they had been “accidentally” banned; those that bothered, that is, to challenge their ban and find out the reasons behind it.

        I also was told I was “accidentally” banned in 2012. To be fair, the admin I spoke to was cheerful and reasonable in bringing my account back to life, but it was a strange situation. In fact, the admin specifically told me: I had been banned in error because, when they re-opened the boards on the new software that year, they manually re-applied bans on a range of accounts; based, I was told by him/her, on an out-of-date spreadsheet. The admin also said I was the first person to expose this issue by complaining and questioning my ban. If the other accounts that got banned (or re-banned) were old and no longer being bothered with (i.e., no-one was any longer attempting to log in with one), maybe that was true.

        What I was told, however, now sounds a bit doubtful in light of reading through those other members’ stories on that other forum. Of course, accidental bans might occur a variety of ways, and not necessarily on the basis of a single and unusual event, like reinstating old bans because the board completely changed software and incorrect data was used, like mine supposedly did… but it certainly makes you wonder if you’re ever getting the truth….

        I certainly wasn’t told the truth about my last ban in June 2017. That was actually the only other ban I had applied on my account since the “accidental” one in the fall of 2012. And it was a “permanent” ban — as I later discovered. If that doesn’t strike you as unjust and deeply fishy in itself… You know, to have had an unsullied record, with no legitimate ban of any sort in more than half a decade; and then suddenly struck off.

        And why? Because I quibbled the oppressive discussion parameters of the new catch-all “Disney” thread in the saga forum, and because I called a mod out for hypocritical posturing. I accused them of placing prequel fans in a straitjacket, and also indicted them for breaking their own rules (“No personal attacks”), because they were clearly insinuating that prequel fans were being obdurate and unreasonable in complaining about the new thread and how restrictive it was.

        It was Heels in particular I challenged in the thread; and he then banned me sixty seconds later. He wiped out the first part of my response, where I called him (and by extension: the rest of the mods) out, and slightly to my surprise: He put his own nasty, false parting shot at me in there, saying I had been warned many times, by many mods. Which was false.

        Here’s my final post:

        https://boards.theforce.net/threads/mega-thread-sequels-and-spinoff-films-and-the-overall-saga.50045774/page-2#post-54397436

        But it doesn’t tell you too much. Because, like I just said, Heels edited out the first part, where I plainly called him and the other mods out for their bias and hypocrisy, and for deliberately stifling dissent.

        They don’t want anyone to know that I was onto them. Look what happened, as well, just above my last post, to another posted called “TheDutchman”. He is literally banned for asking a perfectly pertinent question: If robust discussion of Disney can’t take place in the new thread, where might it occur; or is such conversation no longer allowed? Bazinga banned him instantly.

        That thread was also replacing a much more open thread in the PT forum, which Heels had just closed. But that was also crooked. The PT forum variant was completely fine and some lively discussion had taken place. Including — predictably — troll attacks from Disney fans and PT bashers. Those attacks were used as the excuse to close it. But the real reason for closing it was obviously more sinister: The mods conspired to silence prequel fans who were going after Disney in ways that made them feel uncomfortable.

        Also, in the saga thread, the mod who actually started the thread and posted the rules is one of the biggest hypocrities on the whole board. Every single “rule” she inscribed, she violated herself, numerous times. She delighted, for example, for several years, in repeatedly flaying and scorning Anakin and Padme in ROTS as “morons” and “wusses”, as well as slamming Padme in the same movie for being “an outdated 19th Century stereotype”.

        Worse, she often did so in threads that had nothing to do with those characters, rudely foisting her negative bluster on others and taking decent threads off-course. When prequel fans (and she herself claimed to be one) challenged her very negative and manifestly inflammatory opinions, she would fume back at them, “What???! Are you telling me I can’t have whatever opinions I damn well choose??? LMAO, GTFO.” Yet in spite of her virulence any time she caught a whiff of being condescended to and cowed into silence, she became a mod and started telling people what they can and can’t say about the Disney films and characters; as that thread and its “ground rules” directly attest to.

        So, yes, that is the situation on TFN today. Co-opted by the worst elements of the Star Wars left: the radical/regressive left. Which is brutally ironic in another way. The left has traditionally been politically opposed to fascism, authoritarianism, censorship, and attitudes protective toward big corporations and large institutions, but that same left now increasingly practices authoritarianism, censorship, and shows a keenness toward protecting big corporations. And if you try and dissent, even just to protest the erosion of free speech and civil liberties, you are branded a heretic or an apostate and cast out. Social/Internet critic Jaron Lanier (who has many good talks on YouTube) calls it Digital Maoism. I think it’s an apt term.

        These people don’t believe they are accountable to anyone. And since they are the rule-makers, they set the tone and determine the spectrum of debate. They show the arrogance of Nixon: “If the President does it, how can it be illegal?” They literally believe they are above their own rules. And, in a way, they are. Who can hold a moderating force to account when the personalities, or at least the ideological positions they take, are all the same? There is no one to break their tyranny. No rebellion. No resistance. They are literally the Empire/First Order. Quite as Lucas said: The prequels are premised on the idea that people often believe they’re doing good when they’re actually not.

        Anyway, it doesn’t take much to spark me off!!! Ha. Sorry about that. And sorry for your ban. If you protest it, they might let you back. Might. But you sometimes have to go the trouble of registering a second account; just to question the banning of your first. Which I find pretty ridiculous. And then: Do you want to feel like you’re having to go crawling back and grovelling to get back in? It’s a vile nonsense. And I can tell you: It’s something some of the mods definitely get off on. The mods are narcissists and bullies. Power has gone to many of their heads. As the prequels teach: Power is corrupting. Not surprising that few mods care greatly for the PT; even after all these years.

        It’s definitely a toxic atmosphere on there. Totally and utterly biased toward stymieing criticism of the Disney films; especially the wider transition of power from Lucas to Disney/Kennedy. Whereas people are still relatively free to malign the prequels as much as they like. Provided they don’t commit the deadly sin of straying into comparing the trilogies, or the Lucas-owned and Kennedy-run Lucasfilm eras, against one another. If you’re a fan of the Disney films, you’re basically allowed to act like a pitbull on there. But if you’re a prequel fan with a few critical words to throw out toward the new movies, you have to be meeker than a poodle.

      • Slicer87

        That is well put as usually. I just didn’t feel like it was worth crawling back to that forum or giving the mods the satisfaction as you stated. Star Wars fandom always had some toxic elements, but it seems ever since Disney took over, all they have done is fan the flames and let the inmates run the asylum.

      • Cryogenic

        @ Slicer:

        Thanks. And yes, you’re right: The inmates are now running the asylum.

        In the words of Obi-Wan… Great job, Disney!

      • Cryogenic

        @ Joey:

        You’re not going to get a strong counter-argument from me, Joe. I decried the lack of intelligence, understanding, tolerance, respect, civility, and gratitude from the Star Wars fanbase years ago. These days, I’m probably a little over it, but I don’t really disagree.

      • joey pieper

        @slicer
        had the misfortune to read youtube comments complaining about the clones being all cgi and the usual bitching about the changes lucas made to the original trilogy to those crybabies THEY’RE LUCAS FILM NOT YOURS!

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